Pip collie lab x cushings arthritis

[Squirt's Mom]

Re: Pip collie lab x cushings arthritis

Poor baby. Am keeping you both in my thoughts and prayers.

Hugs,
Leslie and the girls

[Roxee'sDad]

Re: Pip collie lab x cushings arthritis

Hi Julie,
Also keeping good thoughts for Pip. Poor guy has been thru enough and needs to catch some good luck.
John (Roxee's Dad)

[juile]

Re: Pip collie lab x cushings arthritis

stil having lots of trouble with his ears although hes sleeping quite alot at the moment he's only awake for about 2 hrs aday at present he seems really drain and tired but i cant get his cushings check until 5 th june due to the ear drops
julie and pip

[AlisonandMia]

Re: Pip collie lab x cushings arthritis

Hi Julie,

Re the ear drops and the ACTH stim test - I think you have been using Aurizon ear drops on Pip. I see that the steroid in Aurizon ear drops is dexamethasone and this is good because it means that you can have an ACTH stim test done even while he is having them put in his ears every day without it affecting the test at all.

This is because dexamethasone (unlike any other steroids) does not "read" as cortisol on testing. This is why it can be used in the Low Dose Dexamethasone Suppression test that is used in Cushing's diagnosis.

If the dexamethasone in the ear drops is the only steroid that Pip has received in the course of this ear infection then you should be able to get the ACTH stim done any time you want without having to worry about it affecting the results in any way.

Alison

[juile]

Re: Pip collie lab x cushings arthritis

Pip is really not well at all he has all the cushings very hungry all the time drinking excessivly no energy.
His ears are still causing him some discomfort and irration
also his he not walking very well and has only had a walk about 3 doors up and turned striaght round
but its been very cold and damp here so that may be why hes joints are playing him up .
I went to vets today to collect his wormere and they are 100% sure he cannot have his acth stim while on aurizon ear drops has to be 2 weeks minuim so i cannot have him tested to see if he levels are up and his medication needs adjusting


julie

[Squirt's Mom]

Re: Pip collie lab x cushings arthritis

Hey Julie,

Poor Pip. Seems like every time he gets to feeling good, something happens and brings him down again. Just not fair...to either of you!

I am wondering if perhaps the Trilo has caused some of Pips intermediate/sex hormones to elevate, causing him to keep having the cush behaviors. Was he ever tested for Atypical Cushing's with a full adrenal panel from UTK? I can't remember. Having the arthritis worsen when the cortisol is lowered is not that surprising as the cortisol "treats" the inflammation. But the difficulty he has had in getting his cush signs/behaviors under control just makes me wonder if some of his other hormones may not be out of whack, too. Especially since we know the Trilo will cause some of those to elevate. I just we knew what was causing his problem and how to address it. Hopefully the ACTH will give some answers.

Hugs,
Leslie and the girls

[juile]

Re: Pip collie lab x cushings arthritis

Hi lesile

I don't think he was ever tested for Atypical all i know is that they tested his thyroid it was a full panel (a posh test but don't know what its called)before he was diagonesd with cushing and the vet said he definatly didn't have a thyriod problem only one of the levels where low which can happen with a cushings dog the vet did put him on solxine for low level but the medication made him very ill.

when ever pip has his acth stim and we get the results they are either to HIGH or when he was last tested his levels where to LOW so we have to adjust his medication all the time he is either on 2 vetoryl 30mg morning and evening dose or when she reduces him to 1 vetoryl daily he a mess or if its really really low no medication for a week then retest him then his levels are very very high and the vet does what the lab suggests i don't know i keep asking my vet could anything else be going in she said he has behavioural problems but pips not a naughty dog and doesn't show any behavourial problems the only thing he has is separte anxiety but they say that because our bond is very strong if i not around he panics and vomit and shakes even my mum cannot console him hes never left on his own.once i come home hes fine every time i get up to move you can put money on it pip is right necxt to me even when hes asleep at night and i get up because i can't sleep or come down for a drink of water pip will get up and follow then get back on my bed and come for a hug if try and move my hand as it gone dead even though he's asleep he will put his paw up to stop me from moving he more secure when when he's with His mum (but thats because of him being very badly treated beaten starved when i got him he was very thin the bones were showing on his head and they are the last things to go he was stabbed broken jaw cut marks on the inside of his hind legs he had never been on a lead ifeed him when i got him home the as he was covered in fleas i bathed him he fell asleep as that was his first bath in his short life of 18 months and since then we've only had 1 night apart from each other and thats when he had major surgery 2weeks after honey died as there was someone going poisoning dogs and they got pip but the stuff they threow over also had glass metal and wood in so he need major surgery on his intestines and bowel as there was no way he was going to pass that it was 2 weeks after honey died the vet said pip would be better at home with his mum as he was meant ti been for a week but he had an overnight stay.
and sinxce i got him at 18mths old he was unsure what was going to happen to for about 2months nowe he's very spoiled but hes never show any behavouiral problems only seprate anxiety.
sorry i.ve done it again if you got this far down and not fallen asleep SORRY FOR GOING ON AND BORING YOU

Julie Pip

[Squirt's Mom]

Re: Pip collie lab x cushings arthritis

Sweetie, you never bore me! It always makes me smile and gives me the warm fuzzies when you tell about how you got Pip and how close you two are now. He is truly blessed to have found you!

I believe I would think about having the UTK panel done on Pip. If his other hormones are elevated, that could well be a big part of his problem getting regulated. Unfortunately, I believe you will have to take him off the Trilo awhile to get the testing done, but maybe I'm wrong. The treatments for Atyical, melatonin and lignans, aren't prescription in the US and we can get them at just about any pharmacy, health food store, even WalMart. And they are easier on the pups as well as us moms and dads. Something to consider anyway. Hopefully some of those with more experience will chime in on this, too.

Hang in there!
Hugs,
Leslie and the girls

[Wylie's Mom]

Re: Pip collie lab x cushings arthritis

YOU ARE NOT BORING, JULIE!

It's hearbreaking knowing how Pip was treated in the past, but it makes it that much better to know he is now in such a caring home and being spoiled (like he deserves).

I'm sorry he's not feeling well.

-Susy

[labblab]

Re: Pip collie lab x cushings arthritis

Oh Julie, I am so sorry to hear that Pip is still having such problems. I'm sure that it is your loving care that has kept him going through all of these rough spots. And I'm counting on it doing the same, now.

Regarding Leslie's suggestion about testing Pip for elevated hormone levels other than cortisol -- I do think this is something we have touched upon in the past. But since you live in the U.K., the situation is more complicated for you than for us in the U.S. Pip's blood sample would have to be sent here to the U.S. for analysis. That can probably be done without too much trouble. But the real trouble is that you may not have any alternative treatment for Pip's high cortisol OTHER than trilostane. Here in the U.S., dogs can be shifted to a different drug, Lysodren, if it seems as though trilostane is causing some problems. But Lysodren is generally not an option in England. I think it is very difficult to obtain. So as long as Pip needs to have his cortisol level reduced, I don't know that he has any choice other than to remain on the trilostane, regardless. It is such a shame that it seems as though he has a number of issues going on, and that the treatment that helps one may not be so good for another.

I know you have been up and done with the ACTH results, though. And if it starts turning out that his ACTH results repeatedly are too low -- even though he is still having Cushing's symptoms -- then you may well want to talk with your vets some more about having him tested for elevations of other adrenal hormones (this is the test that Leslie is talking about).

Marianne

[Wylie's Mom]

Re: Pip collie lab x cushings arthritis

There is information on the UTK site for shipping from outside the US:

http://www.vet.utk.edu/diagnostic/en...y/shipping.php

[Squirt's Mom]

Re: Pip collie lab x cushings arthritis

and some info on Lysodren in the UK:

Lysodren in the UK/England

http://www.penstone-vets.co.uk/cushings.htm
Treatment of the pituitary-dependant Cushing's Disease requires administration of tablets. A chemotherapy-type drug is used called Lysodren (Mitotane-OPPD). This is a human drug that has to be imported into the U.K. from the U.S.A. under special license.

UK Office
Masters
380 Centennial Avenue
Centennial Park
Elstree - Hertfordshire
UK - WD6 3TJ
Telephone: + 44 (0) 208 327 0900
Facsimile: + 44 (0) 208 327 0901
Email: info@masters-uk.com

[LuvMyMunchie]

Re: Pip collie lab x cushings arthritis

Julie,

You're not boring! I remember reading that Pip was abused prior to coming to you but I didn't realize how badly. What a horrid life he had in the past, poor boy.

He is one very, very lucky boy to have you as his Mum!! Spoiled??...I believe he's very much loved!!!

Louise

[juile]

Re: Pip collie lab x cushings arthritis

Hi Everyonr

Thank you for all your replies,
I know about mititane i asked my vet practice about itbut they are not licensed for that drug but there is a dog down the from my house who also has cushing and her dog is on mitotane (she is at a different practice than mine.i have another dog that live not so far from me and the dogs has cushings she is also on vetoryl her dog doesn't seem to lose any weight and is and still has syptoms of his cushing but as i say hes on vetoryl she is at the same vets practice as us and they prefer vetoryl .

Anyway going on to we called our vet practice yesterday afternoon at 1.30pm, for advice as he really is not well at all .the vet nurse said our normal vet was at lunch but she never got in contact at all (which is very unlike her as she always contacts you back my vet is always very hectic as she a very popluar vet with every one but she only the monday and friday and it doesn't matter if she full booked up with appointments she will always fit Pip in her schedule and if sshe cannot the other vet will go and have a quick chat but she does copme throw and see while we are with the other vet but thats very rare) anyway going back to Pip hes right side is very painful and his stomach is sore he skin is very he's ears still very red and irrating him doesn't like them being touched he's getting like open sores on his stomach he's got know enregy and very lethergic he's not doing anything my mum called and the nurse said she would call us back but a 8pm our vet never and my mum said this is not like onr vet as she hasn't called us mum said there must of been something going that she could'nt get back to us.
So in the end my mum called the out of hours number the vet called us back mum explian what was going on with pip as i've already said she said that even when pip is not well he always has something for a little play but hee's not doing anything he got nothing no energy (by this time i was very unhappy mum said we called and the vet hasnt got back to us she said its not like our vet not to call and she apolized on her behalf of the practice but she told my our vet will always contact is back because its Pip and said our surname even if our normal vet got the message at 10pm she wopuld call because its Pip the vet mum spoke to is going to find out what going on and why our vet never got back tous (but said yes its Pip and she would get back to us because its Pip.
anyway we've done what the vet has told us to do and we just have to watch him over the weekend.
Julie Pip

[Squirt's Mom]

Re: Pip collie lab x cushings arthritis

Hi Julie,

I am so sorry Pip is having so many problems. When did the sores start? Has he been able to see his usual vet yet? I am worried about this latest development in Pip's situation.

It is a shame you can't convince his vet to use the mitotane. It seems that the vetryol is just not doing him justice. The infections, sores, and continuing lack of control of the cush signs tells me his disease is not being addressed by the Trilo. Pip has been through so much in his life, it is not fair that he now has to suffer from this, too.

Please keep in touch and let us know how he is doing.

Hugs,
Leslie and the girls