Bo, 2 yrs old, has diabetes.

[Abby's Mom]

Re: Bo, 2 yrs old, has diabetes.

I warm the insulin in between my lips, as well as under my arm. If it is a little cold, it stings.

Also, I will inject with the flat part of the needle up, and not down. Not sure if this will make a difference, and I also pinch the skin, and sort of slide it in. The pinch is felt but not the insulin.

Hopefully that helps a little. Sometimes it is the smallest stuff that makes it easier.

Barb

[Bo's Mom]

Re: Bo, 2 yrs old, has diabetes.

Does insulin separate in the jar while sitting? I was told to tilt back and forth, not shake, so thats what I've been doing. After I fill the syringe, I put the insulin back in the fridge, then hold the syringe between my fingers to get it warm. Will it separate in the syringe if I hold it too long? As I read this question, it sounds so stupid, I just really want to make sure I'm doing it right. He may just be catching on to the routine too. I'm sure by now he is thinking "Ok, this can stop anytime now!" I feel like he is starting to dread injection time and so am I. Also, what is the honeymoon phase I has heard people mention???

[Bo's Mom]

Re: Bo, 2 yrs old, has diabetes.

Ok, never mind the question about the insulin separating. I've read some of the info under syringes and injections on this forum. I'll watch some of the videos to see if I can improve my technique.

[Abby's Mom]

Re: Bo, 2 yrs old, has diabetes.

That certainly may be possible that Bo is catching on..... I coax Abby into the laundry room (where I give her shot) with a small piece of boiled chicken breast.

While I am giving her the shot, I give her a 1/2 Blue Buffalo Health Bar (the ones with no molasses in them) so she is busy.

Also, I found with the Novolin, that the insulin does not separate at all, after I give it a good roll when I opened the bottle. With the Humulin, it separated all the time.... so I don't worry once I have it in the needle and it is warm, that it will separate once again.

Barb

[Judi]

Re: Bo, 2 yrs old, has diabetes.

Jenny got really crabby about her shot for awhile. She bit me and had to wear a muzzle for about a week. (oh the inhumanity! She looked like Darth Vader)

So I've noticed that when I am careful about making sure the syringe is at a 45 degree angle, it seems to hurt less.

She is also more sensitive on her right side and where scar tissue has built up. So I don't give her her shot there.

I still bribe her. Sandy had told me that Tiggy loves Etta's Duck Jerky (order from Amazon, made in the US, easy to break into tiny pieces.) Jenny only gets jerky after her shot. She loves it, so I think that has been the biggest motivation in her attitude adjustment!

Here is a chart that helped me visual the 45 degree angle:

[Bo's Mom]

Re: Bo, 2 yrs old, has diabetes.

Thanks so much!! Also, I have heard different opinions on whether you should use a needle once, then dispose of (so it doesn't get dull) rather than using the needle for a couple days before starting with a new one. What are the opinions on this?? Also, can anyone explain the term honeymooning? I'm clueless on what this is refering to.

[Abby's Mom]

Re: Bo, 2 yrs old, has diabetes.

I never use the needle more than once. Here is a white paper on it:

http://www.bd.com/us/diabetes/downlo...hite_Paper.pdf

Honeymooning: This is can occur after they have been on insulin for a while, and the pancreas starts to produce insulin once again. Sometimes insulin injections will need to stop, but to only start up again.

My Abby when she was first diagosed was taking 10 units (as a starting dosage) once a day. After two weeks, she went low, and a new vet told me to stop giving her insulin, because with no insulin she had a glucose reading for 124 (which is normal). After about 5 days, she was back on insulin again, but we went slow.... She started at 2 units 2x a day, and slowing went to 5.25 to 5.5 to where she is today.

Barb

[Bo's Mom]

Re: Bo, 2 yrs old, has diabetes.

Good info, thank you!

[Patty]

Re: Bo, 2 yrs old, has diabetes.

Here's a great write up by Natalie on Honeymooning from the answers section http://www.k9diabetes.com/forum/showthread.php?t=2284

[Linda1]

Re: Bo, 2 yrs old, has diabetes.

I don't have to worry about Jake throwing up or not eating, so I give him his shot while he is eating. He doesn't even stop eating! I guess I'm wrong, but I use the needle twice and then throw it away.

[Bo's Mom]

Re: Bo, 2 yrs old, has diabetes.

I tried giving Bo his shot while he was eating last night with NO LUCK. He seems to be feeling so much better, like his normal, wildly active 2 yr old little self but his behavior at injection time is progressively getting worse with each shot. He has caught on to what we are going to do and is really giving me fits. We get him still, and just as I go to insert the needle he slings his head back before I even poke him. When I get the needle in and start to inject the insulin, he slings his head from side to side and back and forth. We can't keep him still. I'm at my witts end! I warm the insulin, I'm using the smallest needle I know of but his anticipation of getting the shot is creating anticipation in me as well. He doesn't act like he feels the needle going in but has a fit when the insulin goes in. After all the chaos is over, he gets his treat and starts running and playing. We all dread shot time now....
Hoping it gets easier with time and trying to stay positive!!

[Abby's Mom]

Re: Bo, 2 yrs old, has diabetes.

Is Bo treat driven at all? Perhaps find something that he truly, truly likes, and only give him this treat at shot time (make it something that takes a while to eat).

I am sure, that he is always picking up on the fact that you are getting anxious as well. So breathe deep, stay calm.

My Abby is a wild terrier, and she can be handful... I try to fake her out at times. Perhaps approach him with the needle, pinch the skin, and do not give him a shot during a treat session. See if you can try to fake him out the next time.

I think Otis is another one, that Bill has to sneak up on... but he is food driven which does help.

Maybe others can lend some suggestions as well.

Barb

[Eddie]

Re: Bo, 2 yrs old, has diabetes.

We also give Eddie his shot while he eats and he rarely even lifts his head up from the bowl - but it sounds as if that is not working for you.
One thing I wondered was whereabouts you are injecting Bo - maybe near his neck / scruff from what you say about him moving his head around.
Our vet said that it didn't much matter where we injected him so long as we got it in. We started over his shoulders but as he has put some weight back on I find it is easier to inject a bit further back - over his rib cage effectively. I just wondered if it might be easier for you to be further away from his head and maybe it would bother him a little bit less.
We also did quite a lot of pinching (gently!) and pulling at his skin all over while he ate so that the actual injection became part of that.
Antonia

[Judi]

Re: Bo, 2 yrs old, has diabetes.

When Jenny turned into Cujo over her shots it was the insulin going in that got her too. I never figured it out. I even made my vet do shots 101 with me again and he said I was doing it right.

Bo may just be sensitive in certain areas. Like Antonia suggests, try different spots and start pinching him!

But I want Jenny to eat so I quit giving her her shot while eating because I didn't want her to associate her food with a bad thing.

Jenny is small so she goes up on the bathroom counter where we wash her face and do her ear medicine (2 other things she hates). She knows she has to behave when she is on the bathroom counter. Bo needs to know you are the boss.

I don't try to trick Jenny. I'll say, Come on we are giving you your shot and then I say jerky about a million times after the shot.

hang in there!

While the 45 degree angle has worked best for us, I think Natalie posted once that they had to do something totally different with her Chris because he didn't like his skin being "tented"

Judi

[amydunn19]

Re: Bo, 2 yrs old, has diabetes.

If Bo is treat motivated, I would spend time doing classic conditioning. I would get out the syringe(leave cap on), touch the syringe to him, give a treat, and repeat several times. Maybe progress to pinching the skin and touching the syringe, give the treat, repeat. I don't know if you have ever tried mat training but especially for a young dog, working on a mat can be so helpful. The biggest thing is only reward the behavior you want.

We have been working with our rescue schnauzer on lying on the mat and she has gone from a scared to death biter to actually being able to just chill out. She used to violently react to any dog but Maggie and she would bark if a strange person approached her. She can now lie down quietly on her mat next to another dog. People can walk by her and she barely notices them. All done with simple principles of classical positive training. Nothing fancy.

Do your best to stay calm - don't make fast movements and keep your voice at a normal level. If you try to grab and hold him still forcibly, he is going to immediately fight it. I would do the work now to get more control. With him being 2 years old, you will have many years of this to go