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  • Re: Mik: 13 yr old Shih-Tzu

    Damn! Had to force feed Mik!
    After 10 days of high appetite and calories, he would not take a bite of anything. Tried them all.

    Finally force fed him 150 calories of baby food and then 3 IU of insulin. I am hoping he will get a high, and return to the kitchen. He did eat a huge 4:30 am meal of 350 calories so this makes no sense.

    Right now, he is sulking in the other room.

    more:
    If he does not get a high and return for more food within two hours, I will force feed another 75-100 calories of baby food. I am worried about the 3 IU of Vetsulin on just 150 calories, but I don't want to break the regiment.
    Last edited by robertpri; 10-29-2009, 05:38 PM. Reason: more
    Mik: ~15 years, 1 IU Vetsulin per 100 calories of Purina EN canned food. BG's coming down, wt going up.

    Comment


    • Re: Mik: 13 yr old Shih-Tzu

      Bob,

      I agree with your plan re: more food to balance against the 3 units of insulin. Am wondering, though, if this problem might not be a temporary one possibly caused by the meds both Mik and Mak need to take and that it will clear up after the meds are done.

      Toodles sulks professionally when things don't go his way. When I need to tell him that's enough of the treats and he doesn't think so, he goes under the chair to pout and to "deprive" me of his company because I said "no".

      Kathy

      Comment


      • Re: Mik: 13 yr old Shih-Tzu

        Originally posted by We Hope View Post
        Bob,

        I agree with your plan re: more food to balance against the 3 units of insulin. Am wondering, though, if this problem might not be a temporary one possibly caused by the meds both Mik and Mak need to take and that it will clear up after the meds are done.

        Kathy
        I could be imaginng this, but at times Mik is so 'smell sensitive' that I wonder. I usually prep his meals first, and set them aside. Tonight, for whatever reason, I did Mak's first, including the mixing of his pills and capsule powder. I then turned to Miks' bowl, using the same forks to mash his Purina. Is it possible the little detective could smell residue from the forks? He has already proven that he hates Maks' meds.


        Toodles sulks professionally when things don't go his way. When I need to tell him that's enough of the treats and he doesn't think so, he goes under the chair to pout and to "deprive" me of his company because I said "no".

        Kathy
        People have tried to convince me that pets don't pout or hold grudges. I disagree. Every dog we've ever had pouts and sulks if they don't get their way.
        Mik: ~15 years, 1 IU Vetsulin per 100 calories of Purina EN canned food. BG's coming down, wt going up.

        Comment


        • Re: Mik: 13 yr old Shih-Tzu

          Bob,

          I would be willing to think you've hit on something. I've had some of mine decide they were willing to take a chewable heartworm med in one strength and not in another. The only differences here were the strength of the med and the color of the pills (they were color-coded at the time).

          About a year and a half ago, Toodles' dog food changed the formula slightly and they added blueberries and cranberries to it. Toodles was eating the food without problems before they did that for a long time. At first he decided he wasn't going to eat the food with "that stuff" in it.

          We tried changing his food and while he was happy to eat it, but there was something in that formula that didn't go well with his seizure disorder and that was the end of that food. We just decided that he would eat his usual food with "that stuff" in it when he was really hungry enough and we outlasted him; he had to get back to a food we knew didn't cause these problems so we were "tough" about it.

          The ones who didn't pout would "talk back" when they didn't get more treats--Toodles does his share of that, but when he realizes his "hot air" didn't work, then he pushes the "pout" button.

          Kathy

          Comment


          • Re: Mik: 13 yr old Shih-Tzu

            It's been two hours + since his 3 IU, so I carried him to the kitchen. I set aside that "poisoned" bowl of food [Mak will gobble it in the am] and had a new bowl of purina mashed with clean forks.

            Mik hovered over it a long time, sniffed, hovered, pondered, sniffed, and then decided I was trying to trick him. He walked away but I was ready.

            Force fed another 100 calories of baby food. If nothing else, I am getting good at this.

            My crude math: when he was eating about 100 calories at dinner, I reduced his 2 IU to about 1.5. But his vet blood tests were still high BG.

            So, now with 250 calories, I am not too worried about 3 IU. And he did eat a huge breakfast.
            Mik: ~15 years, 1 IU Vetsulin per 100 calories of Purina EN canned food. BG's coming down, wt going up.

            Comment


            • Re: Mik: 13 yr old Shih-Tzu

              Bob,

              Mik may yet bark for more before the night's over.

              I think all will be fine but hope Mik will start the morning with a "clean slate", realizing the food is fine and get back to his usual style of eating now.

              Kathy

              Comment


              • Re: Mik: 13 yr old Shih-Tzu

                Originally posted by We Hope View Post
                Bob,

                Mik may yet bark for more before the night's over.

                I think all will be fine but hope Mik will start the morning with a "clean slate", realizing the food is fine and get back to his usual style of eating now.

                Kathy
                You have no idea how much this worries me. I do NOT want to force feed him at 4:30 am, and have to resort to that method.
                Mik: ~15 years, 1 IU Vetsulin per 100 calories of Purina EN canned food. BG's coming down, wt going up.

                Comment


                • Re: Mik: 13 yr old Shih-Tzu

                  Bob,

                  Sometimes the things we worry about most thankfully don't happen like we imagine they will.

                  The other week Toodles irritated his eye and needed ointment in it. At one time, he would have none of me touching that area. Of course I worried about how I was going to get the ointment in that eye twice a day for the length of time needed.

                  Decided I was just gonna go for it and see what happened. Toodles sat down and was so good about it all, I couldn't believe it!

                  I hope that the worry you have tonight about tomorrow is only that and that Mik gets back to eating as he's been doing up until now.

                  Kathy

                  Comment


                  • Re: Mik: 13 yr old Shih-Tzu

                    I know he feels bad because he allows me to hold him for long periods. Usually, it's one minute and he gets fidgety and wants down. When he is hurting, he likes being held.

                    After about 20 minutes, I took him to the kitchen and after long hesitation, he finally ate another 50 calories of baby food and maybe 50-75 cheerios.

                    So, he's well over 350 calories for tonight, and about +600 for the day. That would ordinarily be a good day, except he does not feel good.
                    Mik: ~15 years, 1 IU Vetsulin per 100 calories of Purina EN canned food. BG's coming down, wt going up.

                    Comment


                    • Re: Mik: 13 yr old Shih-Tzu

                      How long can fleas live without a living host? Like an old blanket?

                      Can the larvae grow and hatch without a living host? [like an old blanket]

                      I ask because of all the old rugs and blankets the dogs have used in the past.
                      Mik: ~15 years, 1 IU Vetsulin per 100 calories of Purina EN canned food. BG's coming down, wt going up.

                      Comment


                      • Re: Mik: 13 yr old Shih-Tzu

                        Bob,

                        According to this, they can hold out 3 weeks without a host:

                        http://www.placervillevet.com/flea_life_cycle.htm

                        Kathy

                        Comment


                        • Re: Mik: 13 yr old Shih-Tzu

                          Hi,
                          What is Mik's weight now?
                          I hope you don't think I am being rude but are you trying to get him to eat too much all at once. You know like the day after Christmas when you don't feel like eating. Buddy, who was on the slim side, was just under 5kg and his daily energy/nutrient requirements were about 350 k/cal per day so that was divided up between the two meals. So I tried about 180 k/cal per meal.
                          Jenny

                          Comment


                          • Re: Mik: 13 yr old Shih-Tzu

                            Fleas spend something like 95% of their lives OFF the dog. In the carpet, bedding, blankets, etc. The carpet is a big one and that's why frequent vacuuming will cut them way back. Treating the dog is actually a minor part of getting rid of them.

                            If you have a vacuum with a throw-away bag, you can suck some flea powder into the bag to kill whatever is going into the vacuum bag. If it's a canister you empty, you can empty it and then suck some powder into the canister and let it sit in there.

                            Not sure what all the vet gave you. Sentinel essentially sterilizes the fleas when they bite the dog, which drastically reduces the population by preventing them from reproducing. Capstar is a pill that kills them wholesale for about an hour after it's given. When we had a stray dog here last, he was thoroughly infested - just crawling with them - and Capstar knocked them out. Kind of amazing and kind of scary but they say it can be used often.

                            Both Chris and Jack have always tolerated Sentinel really well.

                            As for ticks... only because spiders move fast do they scare me more than ticks. Ticks make my skin crawl! I have never busted one open - yuck!

                            Sorry about your wardrobe Bob - between the force feeding and the tick treatment, you might have to do some serious clothes shopping!!

                            Natalie

                            Comment


                            • Re: Mik: 13 yr old Shih-Tzu

                              Originally posted by BestBuddy View Post
                              Hi,
                              What is Mik's weight now?
                              I hope you don't think I am being rude but are you trying to get him to eat too much all at once. You know like the day after Christmas when you don't feel like eating. Buddy, who was on the slim side, was just under 5kg and his daily energy/nutrient requirements were about 350 k/cal per day so that was divided up between the two meals. So I tried about 180 k/cal per meal.
                              Jenny
                              You are not being rude at all! I crave all information. Since this thread is so long, it's entirely possible you missed this, but wife did all this stuff for 33 years with 5 dogs and 2 cats. I always loved them, but never understood the feeding, medical, flea, diet, etc side. In fact, never witnessed it. I was gone for work before and then came home after all these tasks.

                              But she passed away last year which why I am such a novice at this.

                              Kindergarten level.

                              Mik is slightly over the same weight. 11 lbs, 9 ounces.

                              5kg = 11 lbs

                              But I am stumped on converting 350 k/cal and 180 k/cal. kilocalories? I cannot find any conversion for k/cal. Naive here, but don't understand.

                              Please clarify. Mik is eating about 500 calories a day. 200 am/300 pm.

                              I am really basing it on rough calculations, plus info on pet food, plus MUCH help from users on this site, some info from vet, but mostly from comparing his intake to his brother, Mak's intake.

                              Mak used to eat about the same, but less now since he's over wt at 17 lbs.
                              Mik: ~15 years, 1 IU Vetsulin per 100 calories of Purina EN canned food. BG's coming down, wt going up.

                              Comment


                              • Re: Mik: 13 yr old Shih-Tzu

                                Bob,

                                See if any of this from Google helps:

                                http://www.convertunits.com/from/kcal/to/cal

                                Convert kilocalorie [15 °C] to calorie [15 °C]

                                "How many kcal in 1 cal? The answer is 0.001.
                                We assume you are converting between kilocalorie [15 °C] and calorie [15 °C].
                                You can view more details on each measurement unit:
                                kcal or cal
                                The SI derived unit for energy is the joule.
                                1 joule is equal to 0.000238902957619 kcal, or 0.238902957619 cal.
                                Note that rounding errors may occur, so always check the results.
                                Use this page to learn how to convert between kilocalories and calories.
                                Type in your own numbers in the form to convert the units!"

                                --------------
                                http://caloriecount.about.com/cal-vs-kcal-ft26383

                                "kcalories is what you see on the labels and what you burn (called Calories, with a capital "C"). kcals is equivalent to 1,000 calories (calories with a small c). So when it comes to dieting, kcals (Calories) are what you really deal with. usually though people refer to kcals as calories with a lower case c including me, but as long as you're talking about food and the Calories burned, most likely the person is refering to kcals."

                                "That's pretty much the correct answer. 1 kcal = 1 Calorie = 1000 calories. Common usage in the US is that a calorie is the same as a kcal (as far as nutrition labels are concerned anyway). Other countries (esp. European ones) tend to use kcal instead....it's a more accurate term anyway."

                                http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nutrition_facts_label

                                Wikipedia-Nutrition facts label

                                Kathy

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