10 yr old yellow lab- new here

[emmas mom]

I was referred here from your sister site k9 cushings. I had a scare a few weeks ago and thought my girl emma had cushings. Recent blood tests do not indicate it at this time however.
Emma was diagnosed with diabetes in October last year. Like many of you, I have family with the disease and I manage group homes for people with intellectual disabilities so I am familiar with it.
It has been difficult to regulate Emma. In early December, her sugar crashed to 36 at 3am. I awoke to her having a grand mal seizure lasting about 2 minutes. VERY SCARY. I've witnessed many human seizures so I knew exactly what it was. I gave her maple syrup to bring up her BG after testing to verify the problem, shaking like a leaf through the entire process. At that time, I was giving her 30 units of novelin. Clearly I was overdosing her. She did have more exercise that day and I'm sure the combination is what caused the seizure. I had no idea that low BG would cause seizures!
Emma is a 10 and a half yr old lab. She weights 90lbs and her weight has been stable since her diagnosis. Since my exercise scare, I have not made her walk more than to go do her business! She has a 3 yr old black lab "sister" with plenty of energy.
Emma currently receives 21 units of novelin n. Her sugar runs pretty high, my vet tells me I need to keep her high so she does not drop. She is home alone during the day. Her food is purina fit and trim. Vet says increasing the fiber is important and I see you all are saying the same thing. Recently, the reason I thought she had cushings is because of an unusual amount of shedding. I filled 6 grocery bags of fur from brushing in a week, pretty alarming. The fur is not all coming out so I am wondering if it is the food. There are 4 dogs here including my sons 2 large dogs in the basement apartment so I just cant afford the prescription food at the vet. It appears that the type and amount of food may be my whole problem with her regulation. Last night she was 387, after her breakfast and insulin dose, 327. It has continued to go down slowly to about 277 right before dinner. Sh eats at 7 in the morning and 6:30 at night. I cannot make her wait any later than that!!!!!
I saw some of the foods you all have been discussing and recently stopped at the store and was appalled at the price of buffalo blue. Does anyone have a reasonably priced suggestion for me to try this weekend? Thanks, Karen

[jesse girl]

Re: 10 yr old yellow lab- new here

hi and welcome

yes seizures are very scary my jesse is epileptic so she has seizure form time to time scary because its hard to determine if it s low blood sugar or a hypo event one is deadly the other is not

a dog that is more challenging can have pretty good regulation but it takes allot more work on your part

my jesse was extremely difficult but we found a routine that worked for her

we found ways for her to get quite a bit of exercise by testing blood sugar before and after walks adding some sugar if needed or a snack

sounds like your testing blood sugar at home thats great now you just need more information if you would like you can post some curves recent and maybe not with food insulin time given and amounts and we can have a look

blood sugar with multiple curves can tell a story not just one or two numbers you want to know what blood sugar is doing during the day and with emma since you have seen a hypo event at night a night time curve is probably important also you may have to have the whole book to figure this out

[momofdecker]

Re: 10 yr old yellow lab- new here

Hello and welcome to you and Emma. The best food to feed your pup is one that she is willing to eat and that balances well with her insulin.

Science Diet does make a non prescription brand that is high in fiber. Similar to W/D but not prescription.

I'm not sure where you are located but if you have access to a Petco or a Petsmart you can sign up for store cards. Every now and then I get a 10% off coupon from Petco. My boy ate Wellness Core RF (he was 87 pounds) and we ended up switching my non-diabetic 80 pound dog to that as well. It was costly but we stocked up when it was on sale and had 10% off coupons. Sometimes Hills has printable coupons on their website for Science Diet foods.

Regarding the exercise, if it is something like a walk, scheduled exercise, you can test pre-exercise and post exercise to get a sense of how it impacts Emma. If the schedule is the same day in and day out, over a few days you may have a good sense of how you could tweak it to keep her safe. Random play sessions may be more difficult to predict.

Holli

[Cebe]

Re: 10 yr old yellow lab- new here

Yes dog food has become ridiculously expensive, but I look at it as preventative medicine. You may have food allergies to deal with and so better food might help. But if it is allergies, I highly recommend a limited ingredient food.

Are you buying your insulin at Walmart? Helps a lot.

I also had a hypo episode with my dog. But I adjusted her dose, did a bunch of curves at home and then leveled her off. I watched her exercise in the beginning but in general I don't limit her. I just factored her dips from exercise into her dose. I knew not to let her have a dose that would make her go so low that exercise would bring on a crash.

Anyway, my point is that Zoe gets a good amount of exercise and I dont restrict her. She chases a tennis ball 3-4x a day in my large backyard. That's a lot of running. She does well. Her only real limitation is her age now.

[emmas mom]

Re: 10 yr old yellow lab- new here

thanks for your advice. I am in Maine so I have access to many pet stores. I do buy the insulin at Walmart, I was shocked at the price difference. I generally do a curve every weekend. I will post one later after work. She is very cooperative with it. She was very used to alot of treats throughout the day so cutting that out was difficult. I now dehydrate our own chicken breast and break it into small pieces to give her at the same time as meals and after each bG test. It has worked pretty well. She does miss those chewies though but I saw what they did to her at Christmas, not worth the increase in Bg. Where do you get the scale to measure food? I regular kitchen store?

[Abby's Mom]

Re: 10 yr old yellow lab- new here

Kitchen scales can be purchased anywhere, including Walmart. My Abby loves chews, and I have found sweet potatoes to be a great option. They last a little longer than some other options... But then again Abby is about 1/5 size of you girl.

Belated welcome to you.

Barb

[emmas mom]

Re: 10 yr old yellow lab- new here

I bought science diet lite yesterday and started mixing it into Emmas food last nite, slowly. Isnt it a bad thing if the 1st ingredient is chicken MEAL? I'll check her sugar when possible this week but wont be able to do a full curve until Saturday.

[momofdecker]

Re: 10 yr old yellow lab- new here

Here is a link to Dog Food Advisor, which gives reviews and ratings on dog foods:
http://www.dogfoodadvisor.com/

Just keep in mind that diabetic dogs are often very individualistic when it comes to food balance with insulin. What works for one diabetic dog may not work for another. Thus finding the right balance is often something that takes trial and error.

[Cebe]

Re: 10 yr old yellow lab- new here

I don't think chicken meal is that bad. I use science diet and its been great for Zoe. But I'm using the science diet balance grain free which is awfully pricey but has produced excellent results for my dog's allergies. And because of her allergies, I have a cold turkey approach and I just switch the food without easing her into it. It can cause loose stool to do it that way but because of the allergies I want her system to start processing the new food ASAP.

Anyway, hope this food works out for you.

As for the hair loss you mentioned in your initial post, Zoe had some hair loss on her belly after being diagnosed. It stopped after she got somewhat regulated but it just froze and the thinned hair remained. But once I switched her food to this grain free hill's food he fur started to grow back. It shocked me and made me think it was her allergies that were acting up on the prior food the whole time. Made me feel like a jerk for staying with that food. . so I'm a Kool-aid drinking fan of this particular hill's food. The price is comparable to what I was paying before, which was a lot, so that didnt factor into it too much. One thing about hill's is they have coupons, which are helpful and I'm in the Petco rewards program that gives me a $5 coupon for every $100 I spend. It helps.

Once you complete the switch, I recommend a full curve. Zoe is still not as regulated as she needs to be because of the switch from humulin to novolin and because of the food switch. So she's due a curve and (for her) a likely increase in insulin.

[emmas mom]

Re: 10 yr old yellow lab- new here

After just one day of starting to mix in the science diet Emma was jumping around this morning like a 3 year old waiting for breakfast. She is ALWAYS hungry but she seemed to have more energy. Maybe it had more to do with her new dog bed mom brought her home last nite!
I'm curious about food allergies. Did Zoe get that diagnosis after the diabetes? Emma has always had high quality food, Iams before it went on sale everywhere or eukanuba, I switched her to the Fit and Trim after the diagnosis. Is there a blood test to detect the allergy? Her skin looks OK, it's just the hair loss.
I'm going to give her a bath Saturday and follow her around with the vacuum for the rest of the weekend to really see how much her fur has thinned.

Thank you all for the advice. you have all been very helpful. I'm grateful to have found a group of people just as crazy about their dogs as I am.

[emmas mom]

Re: 10 yr old yellow lab- new here

So here is what I've gotten for a curve so far this weekend. She has switched entirely to science diet as of friday...
Saturday
5:30 am 324
ate and 21 units at 6:30
7:45am 252
10:30 131
2:30 pm 115
4:30 122
6;30 154
ate and 21 units
8:30 119
I was worried she would drop so I gave her a treat to bring up her sugar levels. Last time she dropped it caused seizure in the middle of the night. I probably overreacted but I was going to bed.

Sunday
2:00 am 383
ate and 21 units at 6:45
8:00 am 248
any advice you have to interpret this I appreciate! I don't understand why she is so high then I worry about it dropping. Snowing here today so we are nestled in and I will continue to curve today. Thanks, Karen

[emmas mom]

Re: 10 yr old yellow lab- new here

tried to upload a pic. I don't think it worked

[Cebe]

Re: 10 yr old yellow lab- new here

I'm curious about food allergies. Did Zoe get that diagnosis after the diabetes? Emma has always had high quality food, Iams before it went on sale everywhere or eukanuba, I switched her to the Fit and Trim after the diagnosis. Is there a blood test to detect the allergy? Her skin looks OK, it's just the hair loss.
I'm going to give her a bath Saturday and follow her around with the vacuum for the rest of the weekend to really see how much her fur has thinned.

Thank you all for the advice. you have all been very helpful. I'm grateful to have found a group of people just as crazy about their dogs as I am.

Zoe had allergies well before her diabetes diagnosis. The allergy symptoms were: hyperactivity, licking, hot spots, excessive and large stool, postules on the belly, and ear itching/smells. I don't know exactly what she is allergic to. Ive never tested to try to narrow it down. I just did a trial and error food test to see if any worked better. CA Natural limited ingredient worked for a while. Then diabetes came along and I switched to a different food because she seemed to have a reaction to the latest CA Nat bag. I recently switched to Hills because I was trying to find a cheaper food but what I got instead was an equally expensive food but a better food. But that's just my experience with my dog and hill's. I'm not getting any kickbacks from the folks at hill's . And what works for my dog is not what may work for another dog.

My opinion on diabetic dogs and food is that you should feed you dog the highest quality food you can afford and that your dog likes because the fact that they are eating is more important than what they will eat.

[stylynjm]

Re: 10 yr old yellow lab- new here

Yes,there is a blood test for food or environmental allergies. For Sissy,they were about 200.00 each. I just did food and had great success as far as allergies go. If ur pic is to big it won't work. Try cropping it,that worked for me. A belated welcome

[amydunn19]

Re: 10 yr old yellow lab- new here

I had Maggie tested for environmental allergies and she was allergic to 63 out of 64 of them. Everything in our house and yard basically. My dermatologist vet said the only way to truly test a food allergy is by elimination. They have limited ingredient diets you can try but they can't have anything else during that period. The least allergic proteins are rabbit, goat, and venison. We tried the rabbit and potato - I really hated it because it didn't seem to have much substance to it and Maggie would drop like a rock on it. I had to get dry and canned and feed it four times a day to keep her blood sugar up. It turns out it wasn't food for her but I feel like there are ingredients in some foods that she is sensitive to. Allergy shots do work for many people except when you have a freak of nature like my dog. They can't put together an effective serum to cover all she is allergic to.