Bogie - miniature schnauzer

[BogiesMom]

Re: Bogie - miniature schnauzer

Thank you Patty,

I am going to take out the fiber tomorrow morning... Not sure the Millet is doing the trick anymore... Tonight he dropped from a fasting of 439 @ 5pm to 120 @ 8:20pm. I am thinking I am going to try a teaspoon of white rice in the morning and leave out the millet. He needs something to stop that drop.

Question...

Does the white rice sound like a good plan for the drop and my understanding is, is that it is a fast acting carb so it shouldn't stay in his system all day? Or should I just increase the amount of Millet from 2 tsp to ??.

And does a teaspoon sound like a good starting point for the white rice?

Thanks for everyones help... You would think I would know this stuff by now but when it comes to my own dog, I'm lost.
Dawn

[Emily]

Re: Bogie - miniature schnauzer

Dawn,
All of this nutrition stuff is so confusing! I feel your pain and frustration!

The only advice I can offer is to make one change at a time and see what happens. I wouldn't stop fiber AND add rice at the same time. Then you may not know which one worked.

Believe me....I've made multiple changes at the same time and it only made things more confusing. You know! You were at the other end of my messages

Once again...it seems like Bogie and Elliot are making those late night calls to each other b/c they are both having those high fasting numbers that are driving their moms bonkers!

Best of luck with whatever decision you make....Bogie is lucky to have such an attentive and determined mommy!

[Patty]

Re: Bogie - miniature schnauzer

I know Dawn. When it's your own dog, it's easy to be so close to the daily numbers. Ali constantly had me scratching my head.

Emily's right, one change at a time is recommended. With the recent change in food though, I wouldn't be opposed to starting with a clean slate. The fiber was present to reduce a late drop you were getting on the Zeal.

Starting with a teaspoon of white rice sounds ok. Better to start small and build up. But definitely let it settle in for a few days.

Question - have you tried reducing the insulin dose to prevent the sharp drop already? Sometimes that sharp drop is enough to produce a rise at the tail end of the curve.

[jesse girl]

Re: Bogie - miniature schnauzer

as patty said it can be challenging day in day out . we have had similar problems and still over 3.5 years later . the only difference jesses fluctuations have narrowed where her spikes are not as high anymore

but as patty knew with her allie she showed physical symptoms to spiking blood sugar jesse has symptoms also where her gums and inner lip get red in response to lower levels or fairly good drops

i believe this is a body response to levels in blood sugar and maybe some erratic behavior . for my jesse the battle is not so much food produced sugar but the bodies stored sugar . i think most of us are under the wrong premonition of this disease from what i have seen with jesse.

the problem is not food or the insulin but how the body tries to balance things out the route of the problem maybe overdosing and it can be mild causing this response . for me with jesses reaction is very predictable . large drop will see a spike back up and symptoms will occur with that red gums and lethargy . jesse is on very small dose of nph .

to prove her spike at mealtime is not a food issue she will drop pretty good with numbers in the 200s the higher the more of the drop and rise quite a bit in the lower hundreds the lower the number the bigger the rise . this is the same dose of insulin .

jesses non meal shot she will drop after insulin but she will usually start in high 100s or low 200s now i give her a mid morning snack her vita bone when she receives this snack the drop is almost stopped in its tracks after she eats it and remains stable at that level till next fasting but not always she could drop a bit lower or still spike up on occasion . so food does have an impact maybe changing the mind of the body on its normal approach to what it might consider a danger where the snack interrupts that process

these biological systems are very intelligent from watching jesse and dont do things for no reason they do have purpose even if we dont understand it .

i think many of us who have tested for many years on a daily bases know there is more to it than meets the eye . thats why vets really dont do all that well with it especially with dogs that are challenged because are understanding is quite small and we dont understand why they cant regulate are pups . not there fault

as patty suggested you may have to reduce the dose and start over a bit . very hard thing to do i know . i think its the hardest feels like your going backwards . the problem is with a reduction you could see higher numbers if the body responds the same way as it did on a higher dose so it could take some time to evaluate if overdosing was a possibility . it can drive you batty sometimes we do need a break and thats what i would do if reducing the dose. maybe spot check here and there and maybe no testing at all for a day here and there. there are actually times where i tested jesse and i dont anymore unless on rare occasions i did have to pull back it worries me and i hope her body does do its job and normally it does but i know there is no garuntess

jesse went from 16 units a day to 5 to 6 units a day and sometimes i feel that maybe to much because i have went down to 3 a day and she had good blood sugar . so thats the root of the problem . wish there was an easy answer . sometimes we get lucky and find something that just make a dramatic change or some dogs start at a fairly good dose the body will accept and works with the food consumed

patty knows first hand what we see the people who do manage quite intensely on a daily bases a head scratchier

[BogiesMom]

Re: Bogie - miniature schnauzer

Hi Guys and Thank you all for your help!!!

I had decreased Bogie's insulin in the past by a quarter of a unit for about 10 days because I thought he may be getting too much insulin but the curve didn't change by much. He still dropped and rose with high ending numbers... That is why I thought it was diet related and started adding fiber, millet etc. There were days his numbers ran good and then days it ran bad, lately his curves seem so unpredictable.
That is why I wonder if his diet is balanced well enough for him, I have been doing some research and think I may be contacting a dietician and have a diet specifically made for Bogie (Just food for dogs) has high referrals if the white rice doesn't level things out. This morning I left out the millet and gave him a teaspoon of white rice and at 8am his number was 269, this is generally when he drops, who knows maybe it did help but I wont know for another week. I left a 1/4 tsp of fiber in his diet so as to not change too much at once.
I will leave things be for a week do a spot check here and there and put on my patients hat... I have been home bound lately and all I do is get tunnel vision on Bogie and then drive myself crazy and test the poor guy all the time.

Bogie also shows physical signs when he is higher, the area below his spine behind his ribs sinks in and he isn't as active. When I see this I can always guarantee he is higher than he should be.

I am going to stick with the white rice for a week and sit on my hands as hard as it may be and then run a curve. If there is no change well go from there.

Thanks again for all of your input and help, I just needed to hear it... It's so easy to help give advise to people but lately for me it's been hard to practice what I preach.

Dawn