Winston - Odd numbers; need advice

[tedybear]

Re: What is the target blood glucose range?

MOMOFGUS-----why do you give pumpkin and the potassium---why---need to know-thanks joe t and teddybear

[MomofGus]

Re: What is the target blood glucose range?

MOMOFGUS-----why do you give pumpkin and the potassium---why---need to know-thanks joe t and teddybear

Teddybear - I added plain canned pumpkin to the diet for added fiber, which also seemed to help with regulation. The potassium crystals were added when my Gus developed calcium oxylate crystals in his urine. The potassium crystals dissolved those crystals and allowed us to go back to the regular w/d food instead of the special diet he was put on to dissolve the crystals (which would have turned into bladder stones), and that special diet immediately caused his sugar to stay way too high because of the fat content.

[Lee04]

Re: New and pretty overwhelmed

Schnauzer weight? We are 4 weeks into trying to stabilize with Hansel (17#), start 4 units 2x/day, then 5, then 5.5, now 6 and lowest nadir is 236 - probably wait a few days and go to 6.5 - having teeth cleaned this week, any comment on the teeth cleaning with diabetic dog?

Hi,
Dasani weighs 22 pounds and was 24 pounds when he was diagnosed. The vet started him on 6 units 2x/day when diagnosed and we stablized at 8 units 2x/day . Just recently he has been increased to 9 units 2x/day and that is keeping him in the 100-250 blood glucose range. I don't have any experience with teeth cleaning on a diabetic dog and hops someone will weigh in on their experience.
Hang in there!

[Aggie]

trying not to panic

Winston, newly diagnosed, has been on vetsulin 13 days, 5 units once a day (with dinner). This morning I took him for his first checkup. He has lost a little weight (from 21.9 to 21.0 pounds) but is otherwise cheerful and full of energy.

They did a fructosamine test on him, and so I had them put a drop of blood on their meter. It read HIGH, which I came to find means over 750 in dogs. His blood sugar upon diagnosis was 500, so it is actually worse now after the insulin. What the heck?

The vet reacted by saying he needs to be on 4 units, twice a day, rather than 5 units once a day. So we will be starting that. But despite my prodding, he didn't seem to think Winston's high reading was an emergency. Is it? We don't even know how high it is, just over 750, which to me sounds SUPER HIGH and dangerous. But Winston has no symptoms other than drinking/peeing somewhat more than usual.

So, I want to ask you guys, is this high of a number something you have seen? Is there anything else I can/should do? The fructosamine test will be in tomorrow (I am assuming it will also be bad).

[jesse girl]

Re: trying not to panic

hi and welcome

its very rare to find a dog that does well on a once a day routine i have seen a couple

the vetsulin manufacture still prescribes a once a day in there literature . not sure why because it really doesnt work

some vets will follow the manufacture and understandable but if a vet has allot of experience they would understand that doesnt work . also just one glucose test and a fructosomine test tells you very little about how insulin works for an individual pup. a complete curve is tried and true for adjusting a dose of insulin

4 units seems to be a normal starting dose twice a day

[CraigM]

Re: trying not to panic

Of course we don't like to see readings that high, but you have really just started a long process. Glad to read he is now on twice a day injections, very few dogs do well on a single injection. Don't be surprised if his blood glucose is still high, but probably below 750, on the 4 units. 4 units is frequently a starting dose for a 20 pound dog. Just as an example, my 18 pounder was OK on 7.5 units years ago, and her needs have increased to 9 units today. Just remember every dog / situation is different any your pup will have his own requirements.

Are you, or are you planning to test blood glucose at home? That would probably make regulation happen much quicker, and less $$$, than running to the clinic every week.

Craig

[Judi]

Re: trying not to panic

twice a day should help a lot. did he have ketones in his urine?

[Aggie]

Re: trying not to panic

We couldn't really do a curve before because we were injecting at 5 PM. Hence fructosamine was suggested, but also I just asked them to put a drop on the meter at 10 AM when we were there (17 hours after his last injection) just to get some numbers. I am data driven. But I still don't have a number.

We should be able to do a curve now once he is on twice a day insulin.

Craig, I have ordered a meter but it is not due here until Friday. I will see if my dog will tolerate testing well, and hopefully I can also tolerate testing him. I am pre diabetic and test myself easily, but Winston isn't the easiest creature when it comes to needles. He has been doing OK with the insulin needle, with distraction and treats. He still stares over his shoulder at me sometimes, and he tries to avoid the needle and just get the treat, but he doesn't yipe so I don't think it's really that bad.

Judi, his urine has not been tested for ketones. Should I be doing that? I know there are (human) ketostix available.

[Judi]

Re: trying not to panic

The vet might have tested for ketones but yes, that is the biggest worry with high blood sugar. If he isn't throwing off ketones it isn't as worrisome. I'm sure he feels awful so hopefully the new routine will kick in quickly. I just bought human strips at a pharmacy

[Aggie]

Re: trying not to panic

But, that's the thing. He doesn't seem to feel awful at all. He is acting totally normal. This morning he was racing all over the house with his toys, shaking and throwing them. He went out on his walk and seemed fine. When he found out he was going for a ride in the car (to the vet) he was super excited and doing multiple laps around the dining room table before I could corral him and get the leash on him. (If excitement raises blood sugar in dogs, that could account for some of it. I guess.)

If I had a blood sugar in excess of 750 I think I'd be in the hospital.

I just don't get it.

[jesse girl]

Re: trying not to panic

now many of us use a human meter so its maybe something you can do or until you get your meter on Friday

[Aggie]

Just a quick question about food and insulin

Hi everyone, thanks for the input for all my questions.

At the moment Winston gets 4 units, twice a day. I give him the shots after he eats to make sure he eats. If he doesn't eat, the vet said to give him half the dose, 2 units.

My question is, what if he eats only half of his meal? Do I give him all 4 units? 3 units?

[jesse girl]

Re: Just a quick question about food and insulin

i give jesse a quarter of the normal dose with no food and half with half the food consumed

[Aggie]

Re: Just a quick question about food and insulin

..........

[Aggie]

Re: Just a quick question about food and insulin

Jesse girl, today he ate only half his meal and I did give him half his insulin, or 2 units. He ate the wet food but left the dry kibble. Two and a half hours later he marched over and ate the dry kibble. Sigh.

So, in a case like this, do I give him another 2 units? Do I just wait until his dinner and get back on track with 4 units?

And, should I have picked up his food so that he couldn't eat again until dinner, rather than have that 2.5 hour delay before he ate the other half?

For those who are following all this mess, his fructosamine test showed 'fair' control, which actually was better than I expected based on his really high reading that one day, and he will have another test in about a week (an actual curve this time, I think would be best) now that he's been on two shots a day. He is also drinking noticeably less, which I take as a good sign.