My Dog Pip is an Angel 08.30.13...

[k9diabetes]

Re: Pip's Story

Boy, you really have to know a lot to judge a diabetic dog by sight. Not always reliable.

This is why I despise UCD's current idea of monitoring regulation - watching thirst and urination and weight only....

[eyelostit]

Re: Pip's Story

I'm glad no pancreatitis, I really feel bad for all our members who have to go thru this.

I can relate to how you think its so much food, as I have been doing with Niki, i look at it and think "I could not eat all of this in one sitting" but I guess dogs can handle it, they would eat and eat.

Don't feel down, and oh the forgetting, isn't this fun just one more thing in my way. LOL

[pgcor]

Re: Pip's Story

Good Morning!!!!!

Well, Pip was negative on his urine tests all day yesterday. All day meaning:

6:00 AM
9:00 AM
10:30 AM
2:00 PM
4:00 PM
5:00 PM
9:00 PM
10:30 PM

Didn't my husband do well? Finally I put the fear of God in him. LOL

Anyway, this morning he tested at 1000 on the Keo Diastix! His insulin has not changed and he's getting more food. So I really don't get that.

I think I should give it at least 2 more days and then see where he is. I want to schedule a curve, but not until he settles down.

[pgcor]

Re: Pip's Story

ooops I forgot to say thank you to everyone for their advice and help! Dolly, I'm really getting bad with my memory.

Over the weekend we had to contact the Vet in an emergency because I put the Digestive Upsets drops in Pip's eyes rather than the flubiprofen. Luckily nothing happened to Pip, but I thought OMG, what have I done?

I don't know what's happening to me, but it's scary because my Mom and all of her sisters had some form of dementia.

All I can say, is that if I have to get that - I hope I forget how to clean the house first.

[Ricksma]

Re: Pip's Story

Oh Pam...that was priceless...there are some things that I want to go first, too! Like, um, I don't know....knowing what my ideal weight is? LOL You crack me up!

Love and hugs, Teresa

[pgcor]

Re: Pip's Story

Oh Teresa - I had my weight officially "done" in High School. I see no reason to repeat it.

[Patty]

Re: Pip's Story

Oh Pam...sorry you had to go through that. But Teresa's right, that was priceless.
Glad for the negative pancreatitis report yesterday.
Patty

[k9diabetes]

Re: Pip's Story

If you get another very high urine test first thing in the morning after all negatives the day before, I would consider the possibility that Pip's blood sugar went too low overnight and caused some rebound.

You might consider a small reduction in the nighttime insulin to be safe.

Trouble with urine tests is it's hard to know if the nighttime dose is too low so there's sugar spilling over or too high so causing some rebound.

Too much insulin is the more likely possibility and the one with the most risk for Pip so I'd opt for the possibility that his insulin at night needs a slight reduction and see if that helps.

... there are lots of things I'd like to forget!

[pgcor]

Re: Pip's Story

I agree with you Natalie. But, don't you think it's odd to have rebound now? Especially with an increase in food?

I will definitely drop his dose at night if this continues though.

Thanks Natalie, Teresa and Patty!

[eyelostit]

Re: Pip's Story

.

All I can say, is that if I have to get that - I hope I forget how to clean the house first.

I have forgot somewhat

[k9diabetes]

Re: Pip's Story

Could be it's just one of those off-the-wall variations that defy explanation... time will tell!

[pgcor]

Re: Pip's Story

Hi all!

I know that you will indulge me here as I'm really quite down in the dumps with Pip.

Since we increased his food about 2 weeks ago, I have not been able to re-regulate him. I don't blood test at home, so I know you can't really offer an opinion.

Pip was supposed to have a curve done yesterday, but unfortuately our refrigerator broke and we spend 1/2 a day trying to get another one and get his food and medications properly stored.

Secondly, it looks like he's gained some weight (weighing him on a home scale), so I think I'll have to scale his food back fairly quickly.

He was at 5.5 units and is now at 6.5 units and we still haven't seen one negative on his urine check.

In desperation I called the Vet and we'll schedule a curve for Monday. I don't know how good it will be because I'll be scaling food back soon - but I don't know what to do?

I really have tried to get blood from him, and at times like this I could just cry. I wish one of you could visit my home and see how he is. If for no other reason than to just alleviate my guilt today.

Oh, how I wish there was a magic pill....

[We Hope]

Re: Pip's Story

First of all, how high is the urine test positive, according to their color scale?

You can also set up to monitor urine 3 times a day using the Intervet tables here:

http://www.vetsulin.com/vet/Monitoring_Urine.aspx

1. Have pet owner test urine three times a day: before the first meal (test 1), before the second meal (test 2), and late in the evening (test 3).

A table is below this and it indicates what action to take if the reading is positive, negative or trace at what times of the day. According to the table with all positives, a curve is suggested.

Those on insulin can gain weight even if nothing about their eating habits have changed.

http://www.mayoclinic.com/health/ins...t-gain/DA00139

"What's the connection between insulin and weight gain?

"Weight gain is a common side effect for people who take insulin. The more insulin you use to control your blood sugar level, the more glucose that gets into your cells and the less glucose that's wasted in your urine. Glucose that your cells don't use accumulates as fat. If you continue to eat as you did before, you'll likely gain weight when you start taking insulin.

"Think about it this way: Before you start taking insulin, you may be able to eat more food than you need without gaining weight because your body doesn't use the food properly. But when you start taking insulin, all bets are off. When your body uses food properly, you may need less food than you think."

We had Lucky on the same amount of W/D canned since starting with it. We didn't need to make any changes to the amount of food even when he was fully regulated on the old Lilly Iletin II Lente or when we were forced to use Iletin II NPH for about 2 months.

After getting onto Caninsulin/Vetsulin and regulating, we had to cut back the W/D because with nothing being changed except the insulin itself, he had gained weight because his body used the U 40 pork Lente much better than it did the U 100 pork insulins.

Leaving the insulin alone at the same dose but cutting back the food did the trick very nicely and very quickly. He'd gained 1/4 pound (small dog) and that was enough to make for somewhat higher than usual bg's. After the 1/4 pound "extra" was gone, he went back to his same reliable, steady pattern of bg's.

I'd go with the Monday curve, see what the results of it are, and have a talk with your vet re: how much to cut back on the food. I think that should get things back to normal in a short period of time.

Kathy

[pgcor]

Re: Pip's Story

Hi Kathy:

I didn't explain myself - but I never do because I'm such a hyper lunatic! I'm sorry.

I've been trying to get Pip's weight up. He has been very under weight since I switched to home cooked food. I thought we had him at a good amount and he seemed to be okay, but the last time we were at the Vet she said he lost a pound and to increase his food. Since then, all bets are off.

So, not only is he getting more food, but he seems to weigh more by our home scale.

He's usually around 500 when we test him pre-meal and shot. He has been higher, but not often. More often he's lower.

The Vet can't take Pip for a curve till Thursday now. Too busy...

I've asked this question before, but I'll ask you - do you think it's okay to force a dog to get blood?

We can wrap Pip up like a taco and then I can get blood while my husband holds him. He absolutely freaks out when we try that though. He's the same way at the Vet, but I figure it's okay if he doesn't trust her.

[We Hope]

Re: Pip's Story

OK, you wanted weight gain and it looks like that has happened. Most of the time weight gain that you intend to "keep" will mean more insulin because you base insulin on X number of units per kg (2.2 lb) of body weight.

You did increase from 5.5 to 6.5 units--don't know when you did but it can take 2-3 days or more to see any results from an insulin increase.

http://www.childrenwithdiabetes.com/...as_insulin.pdf

Page 10

"the size of the insulin depot makes it necessary to allow 2-5 days of adjustment before achieving a new equilibrium."

Here's where some people get impatient because they expect the increase to act almost instantly and they start increasing at a too rapid rate. This is how rebound gets set up--by not waiting long enough or doing too large an insulin increase at one time.

My personal feeling is no on the forcing blood testing. We elected not to home test because both of us knew Lucky. In the beginning, he was trying to hide from me when it was shot time. We were afraid that if we started doing blood testing, we would lose his necessary cooperation for those two shots a day.

While he got over the hiding at shot time to the point where he'd come into the kitchen after eating to get his shot, we still both believe we would have had no chance at giving the two shots a day without stress had I been poking him more than twice a day.

Lucky was professionally tested at least once a week because John is like family to me, so the additional costs weren't a problem. We tested him on different days and different times-for Lucky, we had an excellent picture of what was going on with him. When we were working at regulation or trying to decipher a "bump" in the road, he was tested more often than that.

Lucky was fine with this with all but one associate--when she drew blood, you would see 50+ points in the reading. Nothing bad happened between them; he somehow just didn't care for her. All the rest were his buddies and stayed that way even if they drew blood from him, but I don't believe he would have stood for two shots a day and home testing both.

With forcing Pip at home on a regular basis, I would be concerned about what this everyday stress might do to him. True, it's done periodically at the vet but having someone do this doesn't happen every day.

You might also be putting everyone's effort into this for naught if Pip is the type whose bg's go up or down at stress time; if he goes either way--up or down--you are still not getting what you hoped for with home testing, and that's a true picture of what his bg's are doing when not at the vet.

It sounds like things aren't that bad for Pip because you've been feeding him more and he's gained the desired weight from that. Needing more insulin because of a wanted weight gain isn't anything to be stressed about!

Kathy